MINUTES OF MEETING

PINE TREE WATER CONTROL DISTRICT

 

            A meeting of the Board of Supervisors of the Pine Tree Water Control District was held on Thursday, February 3, 2011 at 6:00 p.m. at the Parkland City Hall, 6600 North University Drive, Parkland, Florida.

 

            Present and constituting a quorum were:

           

            Paul Brewer                                                    President

            Mark Weissman                                              Vice President            

            Donna McCann Benckenstein                        Assistant Secretary      

            Donald Eckler                                                 Assistant Secretary

            Neil Study                                                       Supervisor

             

            Also present were:

           

            Kenneth Cassel                                               Manager

            Annabella Barboza                                          Attorney

            Warren Craven, Jr.                                          Engineer

            Randy Frederick                                             Drainage Supervisor

                                                                                                                                                           

FIRST ORDER OF BUSINESS                             Roll Call

            Mr. Cassel called the meeting to order and called the roll. 

 

SECOND ORDER OF BUSINESS                        Approval of the Minutes of the November 4, 2010 Meeting

            Mr. Cassel stated each Board member received a copy of the minutes of the November 4, 2010 meeting and requested any changes, additions or deletions.

            There not being any,

           

On MOTION by Mr. Weissman seconded by Ms. Benckenstein with all in favor the minutes of the November 4, 2010 meeting were approved.

           

THIRD ORDER OF BUSINESS                            Consideration of Bids for Culvert Inspections

            Mr. Cassel stated we went out for bids for culvert inspections.  We teamed up on the bid advertising with CSID in order to cut costs.  We need to have the culverts inspected to see which ones are to the point where they need to be cleaned out.  Industrial Divers Corporation came in as the lowest bid to inspect all of the culverts.  Part of the deal is they are not only going to tell us the debris that is in the culvert, but also where it is located in the culvert, the type of debris, size of pipe, type of material of pipe as well as verifying the length of pipe for us so that we can update what Mr. Craven already and cross reference.  This will allow us to know exactly what our infrastructure is.  From this we will look at which pipes need to be cleaned and we will go out for a second bid to have somebody come out and clean them. 

            Mr. Weissman asked do we have a prior history with the bidders?  Do we know of anyone who has used them before or any references we checked?

            Mr. Cassel responded yes.  Industrial Divers Corporation and Fish Tec have done extensive work for PTWCD, CSID and NSID.  Have you worked with Working Divers, Inc. Mr. Frederick?

            Mr. Frederick responded no.

            Mr. Weissman stated I noticed Fish Tec did the examination on the banks.  Was that something we bid out?

            Mr. Cassel responded no.  We needed to do that quickly and he came in at a decent number for us.

            Mr. Weissman stated I noticed his price here was almost triple to Industrial Divers Corporation.

            Mr. Cassel stated if you go back in the records, you will find Industrial Divers Corporation was triple to Fish Tec some years ago.

            Mr. Frederick stated there is a battle going on between those two to get these districts here.

            Mr. Weissman stated it is not a small difference.

            Mr. Study stated it is a huge spread from $5,000 to $22,000.

            Mr. Frederick stated Industrial Divers Corporation has gotten beaten out over the last few years in jobs within the other districts.  He wanted to make sure he got this one.

 

On MOTION by Mr. Weissman seconded by Mr. Study with all in favor the bid for culvert cleaning was awarded to Industrial Divers Corporation in the amount of $4,900.

           

FOURTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                        Audience Comments

            There not being any, the next item followed.

 

FIFTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                             Manager’s Report

§  Discussion of Bank Issues – Hidden Lakes

            Mr. Weissman asked what was the cost?

            Mr. Frederick responded he has not billed us.

            Mr. Cassel asked he was there about half of a day; is that correct?

            Mr. Frederick responded he was here the whole day.  I asked him about billing me and he said he got this bid so he was not going to bill me for that service, but he did not get the bid.  I still have not received a bill for the service.

            Mr. Cassel stated we had the initial issue with the bank last year.  We went out and looked at it.  We did some surface type repairs thinking the underlying was not necessarily that bad.  We did it with our own people so it did not cost us anything.  The bank in another section dropped and cracked.  We have something going on underneath.  This is why we brought out Fish Tec to check it to see what is going on.  It looks like there is a hollow spot underneath the rock.  We are not sure why.  It could be an old hollow spot which was there forever.  It could be some sand underneath drifted into the lake.  It could be a number of issues. 

            There is some additional work we need to do to figure out how we are going to fix it.  Mr. Frederick mentioned that some more has cracked in the last couple of days.  We need to make sure the bank is a safe bank because we have a lot of kids going to school who walk down the sidewalk.  You do not want too steep of a bank there.  We are going to have to bring in Dunkelberger as a geotech.  We may need to do a boring to make sure of what we have as far as soil. 

            It is very steep according to Fish Tech.  We are going to have Industrial Divers do some double checking and extra sampling with Dunkelberger in specific spots when he is out here diving the other part to make sure we can come up with a fix that is reasonable, rational and the least expensive fix we can come up with that will last the District.  We do not want to have it keep doing something and have to go repair it every six months. 

            Mr. Brewer stated Mr. Craven, take a look at that thing they are doing in Sunrise on the cave in.

            Mr. Craven stated I was actually talking to the contractor who was doing that.  I personally do not think what they are doing is going to work.  Their situation is much worse then ours.  I suggested to Mr. Cassel that we get a geotech involved.  It is pretty much impossible to get a drill rig right up next to the lake.  I propose we get a sampling as close as we can, off the road on the flat area before you get to the sidewalk.  It should give us the same basic profile of the soil.  I think we all suspect the same thing.  We had a layer of soft lime rock with a layer of sandy material under it which has washed out over the years.  I think we need to get that boring done and I suggested we have the geotechs since we are going to have the divers in the pipes.  While they are there with the pipes, we can get the geotech out there with him and if he needs any additional vat to what we already have we can make sure we pick it up at that time so we are not incurring an additional cost. 

            Once we have all the facts we can come up with the fix.  The simplest solution is we find that we have a couple of more cavities, we accelerate them breaking off and rebuild the slope, or we are going to have to put some kind of retaining wall in there.  The report we received indicates that after we get past the bank the deep cut line is very steep.  We do not want the whole bank to collapse.

            Mr. Study asked how much was the original effort?

            Mr. Cassel responded it had broken down.  We had gone in there with our crews and put weight on it to see if anything else would break.  We went in there and filled it to stabilize it.  It was a couple of truckloads of fill and then sod on top of it. 

            Mr. Study stated I would say the slope is seven to one.

            Mr. Craven stated as a point of reference, these lakes were dug prior to SFWMD requiring the eight foot safety shelf.  Unfortunately, we do not have the benefit of that extra area there. 

            Mr. Study stated when geotech goes out; we need a little more profiling.  It is necessary in order for us to really know volumes.  Unfortunately I did Meacon’s Lake and Gateway Lake, both of which exceeded 45 feet.  We had success with rubble, fill and then a protective berm.  We actually put our dozers on the seven foot banking slope.

            Mr. Craven stated I agree this does not show us everything we need.  We need a more detailed cross section where we can see any kind of cavity which has come up.  This gives us a start, but we need more detailed information. 

            Mr. Study stated we really need the depth and the material which is there as well as where hardness is.  Some of the spots I have found in South Florida are 7 to 15 feet of silt, sludge and product from dredging.  It would not surprise me if this is really soft bottom, but if you get enough loads as you are in that procedure, you can master it. 

            Mr. Craven stated they really did not draw out the section.  From what we see here; 20 feet is the deepest they went.  I do not know if those 20 feet hit the bottom or if it is just the deepest they went.  I need to see bottom and what our slope is there.  With the boring we will be able to analyze the material.  We obviously want to go in deep with our boring so we can see the slope all the way down.  I just think we need to get more information before we can come to you with a repair.

            Mr. Eckler asked if you find, when you have the geotech out there, soft spots or voids or what not, will we need to do other ones in order to find the extent of it so we know how much more bank may be in jeopardy?

            Mr. Craven responded yes.

            Mr. Eckler stated if we are diving, if it happens to be there are other layers further down which have washed out, we should probably know where those are if you can see them from the sides.  I do not know how visible it may be or may not be. 

            Mr. Cassel asked when the man dove, did he go down and check for other spots?

            Mr. Frederick responded yes.

            Mr. Cassel stated and the only thing was that 52 foot wide section he found.

            Mr. Frederick stated he said it was a pretty steep drop off also.  It is almost a straight drop off. 

            Mr. Eckler asked what is the hardness of that rock and how stable can we expect it to be?

            Mr. Craven responded this is why I would like to get the boring done first before we put the divers in again.  The geotech can direct him on what to look for.  I excavated some lakes just east of there and the rock was not very hard at all.  Once you got through it, we used the pan to excavate the rest of the lake.  It was sandy material.  I think what we are dealing with is a very soft layer of lime rock with sand or fragmented lime rock underneath. 

            Mr. Study stated this could present other problems so we might as well do a decent investigation now so that if in the future anything else happens, lake bound, in this particular area, we are apprised of it.

            Mr. Craven stated if you look at the entire lake, the slopes coming off the lots are much flatter than the slope up against the road.  I would say we would probably be close to a five to one slope coming off the backs of the lots.  I am sure once you get to that deep cut line it is doing the same thing.

            Mr. Study stated I am sure that road was an after thought as they were leaving the site.

            Mr. Craven stated probably. 

            Mr. Study stated I would surmise that is not virgin. 

            Mr. Craven stated I see we have a member of the audience.  Can you state your name?

            Mr. Fogarty stated I am a Mike Fogarty, a resident right next door, just to the west of the failure.  I have some photographs.  I am in land development.  I am not nervous about it.  It happens.  I have been just trying to be a middleman, a link to the HOA.  There are a lot of kids playing around it and it has been a year now.  I just wanted to make myself known and available because I know access to there is limited.  Was there a report done by Fish Tech?

            Mr. Cassel responded yes.  We had them do a dive of it.  We have some of the things identified, but in order to do a thorough analysis we are going to have to do a boring.  We have another crew coming in to inspect the drain culverts.

            Mr. Fogarty asked are they doing a boring or a penetration? 

            Mr. Craven responded we will do split pins so we can take samples of each layer.

            Mr. Fogarty stated you might want to do some penetrations about every 15 feet along that whole thing; like 30 or 40 feet.

            Mr. Craven stated the problem we have is access to get close enough to the lake.  We cannot get the drill rig that close to the lake due to the steepness and the limited access.  We are going to do some borings as close as we can get and look at the soil.  We engaged Dunkelberger Engineering and Testing to do that. 

            Mr. Study asked does the HOA have any records concerning that lake and project that you have in hand?

            Mr. Fogarty asked with regard to the history of the failure?

            Mr. Study responded no.  In regards to site survey and typographical information on the lake.

            Mr. Craven stated when it was originally done.

            Mr. Fogarty stated I can ask.

            Mr. Craven stated I have not been able to find anything.

            Mr. Study stated they may have it.

            Mr. Fogarty stated we still had to provide lake cross sections to the District.

            Mr. Craven stated at that point the safety shelf was not a requirement.  SFWMD did not require that at the time and the District might not have been in existence then.

            Mr. Cassel asked do we know who the engineer was for the project?

            Mr. Study asked do we know who the contractor was?

            Mr. Fogarty asked the developer?

            Mr. Study responded yes.

            Mr. Fogarty stated I can look into that. 

            Mr. Study stated you may have a record of who did the excavation. 

            Mr. Craven stated that is one of the older parts of the development.  The area to the east of there came later and we started developing the Coral Creek properties in the 1980’s.  This goes back a ways.

            Mr. Study asked how many years do you think?

            Mr. Craven responded late 1970’s or early 1980’s.  I can go to the city and search some records to see what I can find.  If the HOA has anything, it will help.  We certainly will appreciate it.

            Mr. Study stated I also may have some aerials if I go in my archives.

            Mr. Craven stated when we were researching the area along the Sawgrass Expressway we went to the county and they have the county aerials going back to the 1950’s.  We can find out exactly when it was dug and if we can narrow down who the possible engineers or contractors were, it might help.  When you get something which is 30 going on 40 years old, things have a bad habit of disappearing.

            Mr. Study stated obviously the digging technique will be helpful because we will understand whether they sucked or dug.  Cypress Head was dredged.

            Mr. Craven stated I doubt if anything in there was dredged.  I think it was just dug down to the second layer of rock and they stopped because that is how everything else to the east of there was done. 

            Mr. Cassel stated we will proceed with the geotech person and check out additional diving information to come up with a response on what we can do with it. 

            Mr. Study asked can I be called when the divers are there?

            Mr. Cassel responded yes.

            Mr. Study stated thank you.

 

SIXTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                             Attorney’s Report

            Ms. Barboza stated I wanted to report to the Board that the Board of County Commissioners of Broward County authorized, last year in December, the conveyance of the maintenance map property to the District.  We received a copy of the recorded deed today so it is finalized. 

            Mr. Cassel stated this means Mr. Craven can do the rest of his job to do the DOT swap. 

 

SEVENTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                                  Engineer’s Report

            Mr. Cassel asked you have anything else?

            Mr. Craven responded no.  We just found out when we came to the meeting that we have the recorded deed.  We can start moving forward with DOT on swapping the land north of the Sawgrass Expressway.  We will jump back on this and hopefully come back to the next meeting with a tentative proposal on how we are going to swap the land. 

            Mr. Study asked 441 DOT?

            Mr. Craven responded I talked with Cocomar.  They are pursuing it because they also have an interest in it.  I meant to follow up with him before the meeting and did not have a chance to.  I will talk to him next week and I will let Mr. Cassel know what we found. 

            Mr. Study asked are we keeping the owner who requested that one lot apprised of the process?

            Mr. Cassel responded I have not been in touch with him over the past couple of months, but I will let him know we finally got the deed so we will be moving forward.  I will contact him. 

 

EIGHTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                         Supervisors’ Requests

            There not being any, the next item followed.

 

NINTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                            Approval of Financials and Check Registers

            The Board reviewed the financials.

 

On MOTION by Mr. Weissman seconded by Ms. Benckenstein with all in favor the financials were approved.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

TENTH ORDER OF BUSINESS                           Adjournment

            There being no further business,

 

On MOTION by Ms. Benckenstein seconded by Mr. Weissman with all in favor the meeting was adjourned. 

 

 

 

                                                                                                                                                           

Kenneth Cassel                                                           Paul Brewer

Assistant Secretary                                                     President